<< >> NASA ASRS Report 458614, December 1999

Controller sends B757 around when crew will not call preceding aircraft in sight for a visual separation account visibility concerns.

Attributes
ACN	458614
Time
Date	199912
Day	Sat
Local Time Of Day	1801 To 2400
Place
Locale Reference	airport : atl.airport
State Reference	GA
Altitude	msl single value : 2800
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Night
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : atl.tracon tower : pdx.tower
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	B757 Undifferentiated or Other Model
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Navigation In Use	other
Route In Use	approach : visual arrival : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Aircraft 2
Controlling Facilities	tracon : atl.tracon
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Navigation In Use	other
Route In Use	approach : visual arrival : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 100 flight time total : 11000 flight time type : 70
ASRS Report	458614
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : multi engine pilot : instrument pilot : commercial
Events
Anomaly	conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : required legal separation other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other controllera other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance
Supplementary
Problem Areas	ATC Human Performance Flight Crew Human Performance
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance

Narrative:

In atl (where the natca safety representative says they don't just bend, but rather break the rules) we were on a visual approach to the runway. We did not call traffic in sight because we didn't want our spacing reduced to 2 NM while accepting all responsibility and knew that we would probably lose sight on the traffic once we were both on glide path. We were chided by the controller for not calling traffic. 'What? Are there clouds out there?' and finally sent around because we didn't call it in sight. This game of circumventing mandatory wake turbulence separation in the name of capacity is a dangerous one with potentially grave consequences.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: CTLR SENDS B757 AROUND WHEN CREW WILL NOT CALL PRECEDING ACFT IN SIGHT FOR A VISUAL SEPARATION ACCOUNT VISIBILITY CONCERNS.

Narrative: IN ATL (WHERE THE NATCA SAFETY REPRESENTATIVE SAYS THEY DON'T JUST BEND, BUT RATHER BREAK THE RULES) WE WERE ON A VISUAL APCH TO THE RWY. WE DID NOT CALL TFC IN SIGHT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T WANT OUR SPACING REDUCED TO 2 NM WHILE ACCEPTING ALL RESPONSIBILITY AND KNEW THAT WE WOULD PROBABLY LOSE SIGHT ON THE TFC ONCE WE WERE BOTH ON GLIDE PATH. WE WERE CHIDED BY THE CTLR FOR NOT CALLING TFC. 'WHAT? ARE THERE CLOUDS OUT THERE?' AND FINALLY SENT AROUND BECAUSE WE DIDN'T CALL IT IN SIGHT. THIS GAME OF CIRCUMVENTING MANDATORY WAKE TURB SEPARATION IN THE NAME OF CAPACITY IS A DANGEROUS ONE WITH POTENTIALLY GRAVE CONSEQUENCES.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.