Altitude deviation. Flight crew distraction. Discussing non relevant material.

Attributes
ACN	313350
Time
Date	199508
Day	Tue
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	airport : stl
State Reference	MO
Altitude	msl bound lower : 4500 msl bound upper : 5000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : stl
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Commercial Fixed Wing
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 121
Flight Phase	descent : approach descent other
Route In Use	enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : commercial pilot : flight engineer pilot : instrument
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 120 flight time total : 18000 flight time type : 11000
ASRS Report	313350
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 270 flight time total : 15000 flight time type : 4500
ASRS Report	313349
Events
Anomaly	altitude deviation : overshoot non adherence : clearance other anomaly other
Independent Detector	aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation

Narrative:

Cleared by approach control to 5000 ft. First officer and I were discussing ILS runway 12R approach procedures as WX and visibility was restr somewhat due to haze. Both first officer and I missed 5000 ft as we passed through. Altitude alerter sounded at approximately 4600 ft, I asked controller what altitude clearance was. He said, 'it was 5000 ft, but you're now cleared to cross pauly intersection at 4500 ft, cleared for ILS runway 12R.' our altitude deviation bottomed out at 4500 ft as first officer and I were distracted. Supplemental information from acn 313349: discussing simulator emergency procedures used at another airline. Descended to 4500 ft which is altitude for that segment of ILS thinking we were cleared for approach.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: ALTDEV. FLC DISTR. DISCUSSING NON RELEVANT MATERIAL.

Narrative: CLRED BY APCH CTL TO 5000 FT. FO AND I WERE DISCUSSING ILS RWY 12R APCH PROCS AS WX AND VISIBILITY WAS RESTR SOMEWHAT DUE TO HAZE. BOTH FO AND I MISSED 5000 FT AS WE PASSED THROUGH. ALT ALERTER SOUNDED AT APPROX 4600 FT, I ASKED CTLR WHAT ALT CLRNC WAS. HE SAID, 'IT WAS 5000 FT, BUT YOU'RE NOW CLRED TO CROSS PAULY INTXN AT 4500 FT, CLRED FOR ILS RWY 12R.' OUR ALTDEV BOTTOMED OUT AT 4500 FT AS FO AND I WERE DISTRACTED. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 313349: DISCUSSING SIMULATOR EMER PROCS USED AT ANOTHER AIRLINE. DSNDED TO 4500 FT WHICH IS ALT FOR THAT SEGMENT OF ILS THINKING WE WERE CLRED FOR APCH.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.