Deviation noted from limits of holding pattern.

Attributes
ACN	114275
Time
Date	198906
Day	Wed
Local Time Of Day	1801 To 2400
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : gso
State Reference	NC
Altitude	msl bound lower : 33000 msl bound upper : 33000
Environment
Flight Conditions	Mixed
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Medium Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng
Flight Phase	cruise other cruise other other
Route In Use	enroute airway : j75
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 210 flight time total : 18000 flight time type : 210
ASRS Report	114275
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : first officer
Qualification	pilot : commercial pilot : instrument
Events
Anomaly	non adherence : clearance other anomaly other other spatial deviation
Independent Detector	other controllera other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	none taken : anomaly accepted
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Ambiguous
Air Traffic Incident	Pilot Deviation other
Situations
ATC Facility	other physical facility procedure or policy : unspecified

Narrative:

While holding, ZDC advised we had gone beyond the holding fix limits. We advised center we had not. ZDC had said the same thing to another flight a few minutes previously. Sequence: 1) cleared to the gso-058/60, left turns, 20 mi legs, maintain FL330, efc 2306. 2) cleared to the gso-038/50, right turns, 20 mi legs, FL330, efc 2331 make a left turn to 360 degree and intercept. 3) this vector actually made an intercept of the gso-038 degree radial at the 70 mi fix. 4) entered holding. 5) at the outbnd end of the holding pattern ZDC advised we were 15 mi northeast of gso and had exceeded holding limits (actual position was 25 mi northeast of gso). 6) advised ZDC we had not gone outside of holding airspace. 7) reclred by ZDC to same holding pattern with 10 mi legs. 8) at the fix end of the holding pattern (50 mi) I requested ZDC to confirm our position at that point. I told center the reason for the request was that our position at the outbnd end of the fix was 10 mi different than where he said we were. ZDC then said something to the effect that 'you do admit that you had overflown the holding pattern by 5 mi'. I said negative. It is possible that the mapping feature was incorrect on his radar but it is my real feeling that I was talking to a controller that did not understand the construction of a holding pattern.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: DEVIATION NOTED FROM LIMITS OF HOLDING PATTERN.

Narrative: WHILE HOLDING, ZDC ADVISED WE HAD GONE BEYOND THE HOLDING FIX LIMITS. WE ADVISED CENTER WE HAD NOT. ZDC HAD SAID THE SAME THING TO ANOTHER FLT A FEW MINUTES PREVIOUSLY. SEQUENCE: 1) CLRED TO THE GSO-058/60, LEFT TURNS, 20 MI LEGS, MAINTAIN FL330, EFC 2306. 2) CLRED TO THE GSO-038/50, RIGHT TURNS, 20 MI LEGS, FL330, EFC 2331 MAKE A LEFT TURN TO 360 DEG AND INTERCEPT. 3) THIS VECTOR ACTUALLY MADE AN INTERCEPT OF THE GSO-038 DEG RADIAL AT THE 70 MI FIX. 4) ENTERED HOLDING. 5) AT THE OUTBND END OF THE HOLDING PATTERN ZDC ADVISED WE WERE 15 MI NE OF GSO AND HAD EXCEEDED HOLDING LIMITS (ACTUAL POSITION WAS 25 MI NE OF GSO). 6) ADVISED ZDC WE HAD NOT GONE OUTSIDE OF HOLDING AIRSPACE. 7) RECLRED BY ZDC TO SAME HOLDING PATTERN WITH 10 MI LEGS. 8) AT THE FIX END OF THE HOLDING PATTERN (50 MI) I REQUESTED ZDC TO CONFIRM OUR POSITION AT THAT POINT. I TOLD CENTER THE REASON FOR THE REQUEST WAS THAT OUR POSITION AT THE OUTBND END OF THE FIX WAS 10 MI DIFFERENT THAN WHERE HE SAID WE WERE. ZDC THEN SAID SOMETHING TO THE EFFECT THAT 'YOU DO ADMIT THAT YOU HAD OVERFLOWN THE HOLDING PATTERN BY 5 MI'. I SAID NEGATIVE. IT IS POSSIBLE THAT THE MAPPING FEATURE WAS INCORRECT ON HIS RADAR BUT IT IS MY REAL FEELING THAT I WAS TALKING TO A CTLR THAT DID NOT UNDERSTAND THE CONSTRUCTION OF A HOLDING PATTERN.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.