|37000 Feet||Browse and search NASA's
Aviation Safety Reporting System
|Local Time Of Day||1201 To 1800|
|Locale Reference||atc facility : phl|
airport : pne
|Altitude||msl bound lower : 1800|
msl bound upper : 2000
|Controlling Facilities||tracon : phl|
tower : lax
|Make Model Name||Small Aircraft, Low Wing, 1 Eng, Retractable Gear|
|Flight Phase||cruise other|
|Route In Use||enroute : direct|
|Function||observation : passenger|
|Qualification||pilot : instrument|
pilot : commercial
pilot : cfi
|Experience||flight time last 90 days : 164|
flight time total : 6830
flight time type : 1280
|Function||instruction : instructor|
|Qualification||pilot : cfi|
|Anomaly||other anomaly other|
|Independent Detector||other other : unspecified|
|Resolutory Action||none taken : detected after the fact|
|Consequence||faa : reviewed incident with flight crew|
|Primary Problem||Flight Crew Human Performance|
|Air Traffic Incident||Pilot Deviation|
The flight in question was conducted from pne to ilg to return the ferry pilot (me) to the maintenance base. I was in the aircraft strictly as a passenger. We departed pne at XA00 local. I was in the back seat reading. The front left and right seats were occupied by 2 men which I believe to be a mechanic and student/private pilot and a flight instrument, respectively. A few mins after takeoff, I looked up from my reading and noticed the roxborough tv antennas on the right side of the aircraft. A few mins later I again looked up for a bit and noticed the altimeter indicating 1800-2000' MSL. Shortly afterwards, I looked up once more and saw the springton reservoir on my right side. About this time all these bits and pieces started to gel. I checked the TCA chart that I had used on the flight up to pne, and sure enough we were (and had been) in the TCA. I looked more closely at the instrument panel and didn't see and indication that either pilot was either working phl approach or using the VOR's to help remain clear of the TCA. I started to advise them of what I saw, and then stopped. Partly because we were beginning to descend out of TCA, but also because I felt uncomfortable about meddling in their operation. Shortly afterwards we landed at ilg west/O incident. I didn't feel right about the whole thing afterwards. If I had to do it over again, I would meddle regardless of how I or anyone felt about it. The fact that I had no responsibility as a crew member ignores the issue that I had a real interest in the outcome of the flight. I guess I was also guilty of naivety. I spend a great deal of time teaching other people how to deal with the TCA's, including avoidance of them when ATC cannot clear them in, and of avoiding penetration of them myself. I'm probably guilty of assuming that everyone who operates near them takes the same or greater precautions. I got the gut feeling that they were attempting to avoid entry into the TCA, but like so many other pilots, were not making full use of both RNAV aids or highly visible/recognizable landmarks. I suspect that they were looking at phl and merely remaining clear of the air traffic area. I very seldom fly west/O being a required crewmember (PIC, sic or PIC/CFI), and so am almost always in a position where my vote counts. In the future, I'm going to continue to look out for #1, regardless of whether or not I have a specific legal obligation. Callback conversation with reporter revealed the following: did not discuss with the pilot on arrival at ilg. Aircraft was not operated by his company. He did not know the instructor pilot or the student pilot. Feels the student may have had a private license, but not sure. Is convinced the aircraft had to have penetrated the TCA. Was not sure if the aircraft had mode C or if the transponder was on. No flight plan was filed as far as he knows.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: TCA PENETRATION WITHOUT CLRNC.
Narrative: THE FLT IN QUESTION WAS CONDUCTED FROM PNE TO ILG TO RETURN THE FERRY PLT (ME) TO THE MAINT BASE. I WAS IN THE ACFT STRICTLY AS A PAX. WE DEPARTED PNE AT XA00 LCL. I WAS IN THE BACK SEAT READING. THE FRONT LEFT AND RIGHT SEATS WERE OCCUPIED BY 2 MEN WHICH I BELIEVE TO BE A MECH AND STUDENT/PVT PLT AND A FLT INSTR, RESPECTIVELY. A FEW MINS AFTER TKOF, I LOOKED UP FROM MY READING AND NOTICED THE ROXBOROUGH TV ANTENNAS ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE ACFT. A FEW MINS LATER I AGAIN LOOKED UP FOR A BIT AND NOTICED THE ALTIMETER INDICATING 1800-2000' MSL. SHORTLY AFTERWARDS, I LOOKED UP ONCE MORE AND SAW THE SPRINGTON RESERVOIR ON MY RIGHT SIDE. ABOUT THIS TIME ALL THESE BITS AND PIECES STARTED TO GEL. I CHKED THE TCA CHART THAT I HAD USED ON THE FLT UP TO PNE, AND SURE ENOUGH WE WERE (AND HAD BEEN) IN THE TCA. I LOOKED MORE CLOSELY AT THE INSTRUMENT PANEL AND DIDN'T SEE AND INDICATION THAT EITHER PLT WAS EITHER WORKING PHL APCH OR USING THE VOR'S TO HELP REMAIN CLR OF THE TCA. I STARTED TO ADVISE THEM OF WHAT I SAW, AND THEN STOPPED. PARTLY BECAUSE WE WERE BEGINNING TO DSND OUT OF TCA, BUT ALSO BECAUSE I FELT UNCOMFORTABLE ABOUT MEDDLING IN THEIR OPERATION. SHORTLY AFTERWARDS WE LANDED AT ILG W/O INCIDENT. I DIDN'T FEEL RIGHT ABOUT THE WHOLE THING AFTERWARDS. IF I HAD TO DO IT OVER AGAIN, I WOULD MEDDLE REGARDLESS OF HOW I OR ANYONE FELT ABOUT IT. THE FACT THAT I HAD NO RESPONSIBILITY AS A CREW MEMBER IGNORES THE ISSUE THAT I HAD A REAL INTEREST IN THE OUTCOME OF THE FLT. I GUESS I WAS ALSO GUILTY OF NAIVETY. I SPEND A GREAT DEAL OF TIME TEACHING OTHER PEOPLE HOW TO DEAL WITH THE TCA'S, INCLUDING AVOIDANCE OF THEM WHEN ATC CANNOT CLR THEM IN, AND OF AVOIDING PENETRATION OF THEM MYSELF. I'M PROBABLY GUILTY OF ASSUMING THAT EVERYONE WHO OPERATES NEAR THEM TAKES THE SAME OR GREATER PRECAUTIONS. I GOT THE GUT FEELING THAT THEY WERE ATTEMPTING TO AVOID ENTRY INTO THE TCA, BUT LIKE SO MANY OTHER PLTS, WERE NOT MAKING FULL USE OF BOTH RNAV AIDS OR HIGHLY VISIBLE/RECOGNIZABLE LANDMARKS. I SUSPECT THAT THEY WERE LOOKING AT PHL AND MERELY REMAINING CLR OF THE ATA. I VERY SELDOM FLY W/O BEING A REQUIRED CREWMEMBER (PIC, SIC OR PIC/CFI), AND SO AM ALMOST ALWAYS IN A POSITION WHERE MY VOTE COUNTS. IN THE FUTURE, I'M GOING TO CONTINUE TO LOOK OUT FOR #1, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT I HAVE A SPECIFIC LEGAL OBLIGATION. CALLBACK CONVERSATION WITH RPTR REVEALED THE FOLLOWING: DID NOT DISCUSS WITH THE PLT ON ARR AT ILG. ACFT WAS NOT OPERATED BY HIS COMPANY. HE DID NOT KNOW THE INSTRUCTOR PLT OR THE STUDENT PLT. FEELS THE STUDENT MAY HAVE HAD A PVT LICENSE, BUT NOT SURE. IS CONVINCED THE ACFT HAD TO HAVE PENETRATED THE TCA. WAS NOT SURE IF THE ACFT HAD MODE C OR IF THE TRANSPONDER WAS ON. NO FLT PLAN WAS FILED AS FAR AS HE KNOWS.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.