|37000 Feet||Browse and search NASA's
Aviation Safety Reporting System
|Local Time Of Day||1801 To 2400|
|Locale Reference||intersection : zzzz|
|Altitude||msl single value : 33000|
|Controlling Facilities||artcc : zny.artcc|
|Operator||common carrier : air carrier|
|Make Model Name||B767-300 and 300 ER|
|Operating Under FAR Part||Part 121|
|Navigation In Use||other|
|Flight Phase||cruise : level|
|Route In Use||enroute : atlantic|
|Affiliation||company : air carrier|
|Function||flight crew : captain|
oversight : pic
|Affiliation||company : air carrier|
|Function||flight crew : relief pilot|
|Anomaly||other spatial deviation|
|Independent Detector||other controllera|
|Resolutory Action||none taken : detected after the fact|
|Consequence||faa : reviewed incident with flight crew|
|Problem Areas||ATC Human Performance|
|Primary Problem||ATC Human Performance|
Between waypoints 4060N and 4350N we requested and received clearance from new york oceanic to deviate 20 NM left to avoid convective activity on route. Clearance was restr to be back on course by waypoint 4350N. We complied and gave standard random track posrep/met at 4350N. Midway between 4350N and 4440N we received an unsolicited clearance to proceed direct to 4439n04602w thence to 4440N and as filed. That point was approximately 80 NM due north of our present position. Due to the lag in communications occasioned by our continued reliance on 1950's radio technology; rather than waste time querying the controller and waiting for a response; we complied with the clearance. About 10 mins after passing and reporting 4439n04602w we were asked by ATC if we were still deviating; and we replied that we had never asked for a deviation beyond 4350N and were proceeding direct to the next cleared point; 4440N as instructed. About 5 mins later; ATC asked us for our present position; which we relayed. About 5 mins after that; ZNY patched through to us directly and asked for the circumstances surrounding the clearance to the point north of track. We reported that we had not asked for it; there was no WX problem; and we had no idea why we had received the clearance. A short time after passing and reporting 4440N we received another direct call from ZNY advising us that there was some sort of misunderstanding on their end we had done nothing wrong. Fortunately; we were on a random route well south of the nat's; otherwise; such a deviation might have been a little more interesting. Supplemental information from acn 705194: both captain and I copied down coordinates. I loaded the position in the FMC. The position was 77 NM north of the ppos -- a 90 degree left turn. I erased the point prior to confirming with the captain and re-entered. I thought I made an error typing. I reloaded the point. Still 77 NM north. The captain and I confirmed the point on what we copied down and it was the same. I executed and LNAV the point. I recommended to the captain that we confirm the point with new york. The captain contacted new york to confirm. We both copied down the coordinates again and they were the same. The captain made a position report over the new point with 44n40w as next position. About 5 mins after the report; received a call from new york with a phone patch from new york oceanic. They asked for our ppos. The captain read the ppos. They asked us why we were deviating. The captain's reply was that we were not deviating but flying the clearance that we received from new york comrdo. New york roger'ed and terminated phone patch. The captain made the position report over 44n40w with santa maria. About 10 mins later we received another call from new york with another phone patch from new york oceanic. They wanted us not to worry about the problem; that the problem was on their end and we had done nothing wrong. Very strange indeed. Glad we were not on a published track.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A B767-300 IN ATLANTIC AIRSPACE RECEIVED A QUESTIONABLE ROUTING CLRNC FROM NEW YORK OCEANIC.
Narrative: BTWN WAYPOINTS 4060N AND 4350N WE REQUESTED AND RECEIVED CLRNC FROM NEW YORK OCEANIC TO DEVIATE 20 NM L TO AVOID CONVECTIVE ACTIVITY ON RTE. CLRNC WAS RESTR TO BE BACK ON COURSE BY WAYPOINT 4350N. WE COMPLIED AND GAVE STANDARD RANDOM TRACK POSREP/MET AT 4350N. MIDWAY BTWN 4350N AND 4440N WE RECEIVED AN UNSOLICITED CLRNC TO PROCEED DIRECT TO 4439N04602W THENCE TO 4440N AND AS FILED. THAT POINT WAS APPROX 80 NM DUE N OF OUR PRESENT POS. DUE TO THE LAG IN COMS OCCASIONED BY OUR CONTINUED RELIANCE ON 1950'S RADIO TECHNOLOGY; RATHER THAN WASTE TIME QUERYING THE CTLR AND WAITING FOR A RESPONSE; WE COMPLIED WITH THE CLRNC. ABOUT 10 MINS AFTER PASSING AND RPTING 4439N04602W WE WERE ASKED BY ATC IF WE WERE STILL DEVIATING; AND WE REPLIED THAT WE HAD NEVER ASKED FOR A DEV BEYOND 4350N AND WERE PROCEEDING DIRECT TO THE NEXT CLRED POINT; 4440N AS INSTRUCTED. ABOUT 5 MINS LATER; ATC ASKED US FOR OUR PRESENT POS; WHICH WE RELAYED. ABOUT 5 MINS AFTER THAT; ZNY PATCHED THROUGH TO US DIRECTLY AND ASKED FOR THE CIRCUMSTANCES SURROUNDING THE CLRNC TO THE POINT N OF TRACK. WE RPTED THAT WE HAD NOT ASKED FOR IT; THERE WAS NO WX PROB; AND WE HAD NO IDEA WHY WE HAD RECEIVED THE CLRNC. A SHORT TIME AFTER PASSING AND RPTING 4440N WE RECEIVED ANOTHER DIRECT CALL FROM ZNY ADVISING US THAT THERE WAS SOME SORT OF MISUNDERSTANDING ON THEIR END WE HAD DONE NOTHING WRONG. FORTUNATELY; WE WERE ON A RANDOM RTE WELL S OF THE NAT'S; OTHERWISE; SUCH A DEV MIGHT HAVE BEEN A LITTLE MORE INTERESTING. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 705194: BOTH CAPT AND I COPIED DOWN COORDINATES. I LOADED THE POS IN THE FMC. THE POS WAS 77 NM N OF THE PPOS -- A 90 DEG L TURN. I ERASED THE POINT PRIOR TO CONFIRMING WITH THE CAPT AND RE-ENTERED. I THOUGHT I MADE AN ERROR TYPING. I RELOADED THE POINT. STILL 77 NM N. THE CAPT AND I CONFIRMED THE POINT ON WHAT WE COPIED DOWN AND IT WAS THE SAME. I EXECUTED AND LNAV THE POINT. I RECOMMENDED TO THE CAPT THAT WE CONFIRM THE POINT WITH NEW YORK. THE CAPT CONTACTED NEW YORK TO CONFIRM. WE BOTH COPIED DOWN THE COORDINATES AGAIN AND THEY WERE THE SAME. THE CAPT MADE A POS RPT OVER THE NEW POINT WITH 44N40W AS NEXT POS. ABOUT 5 MINS AFTER THE RPT; RECEIVED A CALL FROM NEW YORK WITH A PHONE PATCH FROM NEW YORK OCEANIC. THEY ASKED FOR OUR PPOS. THE CAPT READ THE PPOS. THEY ASKED US WHY WE WERE DEVIATING. THE CAPT'S REPLY WAS THAT WE WERE NOT DEVIATING BUT FLYING THE CLRNC THAT WE RECEIVED FROM NEW YORK COMRDO. NEW YORK ROGER'ED AND TERMINATED PHONE PATCH. THE CAPT MADE THE POS RPT OVER 44N40W WITH SANTA MARIA. ABOUT 10 MINS LATER WE RECEIVED ANOTHER CALL FROM NEW YORK WITH ANOTHER PHONE PATCH FROM NEW YORK OCEANIC. THEY WANTED US NOT TO WORRY ABOUT THE PROB; THAT THE PROB WAS ON THEIR END AND WE HAD DONE NOTHING WRONG. VERY STRANGE INDEED. GLAD WE WERE NOT ON A PUBLISHED TRACK.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.