C180 pilot in a non movement area on the airport called ground control for taxi information before s...

Attributes
ACN	687343
Time
Date	200602
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	airport : dpa.airport
State Reference	IL
Altitude	agl single value : 0
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Operator	general aviation : personal
Make Model Name	Cessna 180 Skywagon
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 91
Flight Phase	ground : taxi
Flight Plan	None
Person 1
Affiliation	other
Function	flight crew : single pilot
Qualification	pilot : flight engineer pilot : private pilot : multi engine pilot : commercial pilot : atp pilot : cfi
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 120 flight time total : 13400 flight time type : 500
ASRS Report	687343
Person 2
Affiliation	government : faa
Function	controller : ground
Events
Anomaly	non adherence : clearance non adherence : far
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	none taken : anomaly accepted
Consequence	faa : assigned or threatened penalties
Supplementary
Problem Areas	Flight Crew Human Performance ATC Human Performance
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance

Narrative:

Contacted ground. Informed VFR departure northbound with ATIS with understanding of filing a VFR pre departure clearance. Controller cleared runway 2R via taxiway C highspd runway 15. I requested runway 33. Controller 'unavailable.' I responded 'ok.' pwred down radio to run the before start checklist. After engine start; called ground for taxi. Controller aggressively inquired our whereabouts; why we haven't moved; told us to call the tower for possible FAA violation; and stated that this is a set time between clearance to aircraft movement and said that it is an far. He was; of course; incorrect; but after flight I verified by reviewing pubs. Shut down engine and called ground controller via cell phone. He repeats aggressive position. Debate back and forth over semantics. Stated there would be a violation filed. Requested to speak to supervisor. The controller said that the supervisor was not on duty. I requested the controller's name for reference but he would not yield name. I inquired if I needed to file any counter written report or (NASA). Also inquired if runway incursion; or traffic conflict. Controller reply; 'none but could have.' I responded 'we have not moved from our non movement area; how could we have possibly conflicted with any traffic or runway incursion?' after a very unproductive debate; I asked again if any action was to be taken. The controller implied no action will be taken. I then departed with no further issue. Inquired with union as to follow-up. They reply no action taken or required. In summary: I incorrectly thought a pre departure clearance was required and made the first contact with that in mind; as experienced in class B or class C airports. A mistake on the conservative side of safety. I was incorrect to power down radio for engine start as per checklist without indicating to controller. I was wrongly out of communication for approximately 2-4 mins with executing the before engine start checklist. The controller used poor judgement in his unprofessional threat of violation and tongue lashing over the frequency demonstrated a poor understanding of pilot controller responsibilities.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: C180 PLT IN A NON MOVEMENT AREA ON THE ARPT CALLED GND CTL FOR TAXI INFO BEFORE STARTING ENG. AFTER ENG START; THE PLT CALLED GND CTL FOR TAXI AND WAS THREATENED WITH A VIOLATION FOR NOT TAXIING IN A TIMELY MANNER.

Narrative: CONTACTED GND. INFORMED VFR DEP NBOUND WITH ATIS WITH UNDERSTANDING OF FILING A VFR PDC. CTLR CLRED RWY 2R VIA TXWY C HIGHSPD RWY 15. I REQUESTED RWY 33. CTLR 'UNAVAILABLE.' I RESPONDED 'OK.' PWRED DOWN RADIO TO RUN THE BEFORE START CHKLIST. AFTER ENG START; CALLED GND FOR TAXI. CTLR AGGRESSIVELY INQUIRED OUR WHEREABOUTS; WHY WE HAVEN'T MOVED; TOLD US TO CALL THE TWR FOR POSSIBLE FAA VIOLATION; AND STATED THAT THIS IS A SET TIME BTWN CLRNC TO ACFT MOVEMENT AND SAID THAT IT IS AN FAR. HE WAS; OF COURSE; INCORRECT; BUT AFTER FLT I VERIFIED BY REVIEWING PUBS. SHUT DOWN ENG AND CALLED GND CTLR VIA CELL PHONE. HE REPEATS AGGRESSIVE POS. DEBATE BACK AND FORTH OVER SEMANTICS. STATED THERE WOULD BE A VIOLATION FILED. REQUESTED TO SPEAK TO SUPVR. THE CTLR SAID THAT THE SUPVR WAS NOT ON DUTY. I REQUESTED THE CTLR'S NAME FOR REF BUT HE WOULD NOT YIELD NAME. I INQUIRED IF I NEEDED TO FILE ANY COUNTER WRITTEN RPT OR (NASA). ALSO INQUIRED IF RWY INCURSION; OR TFC CONFLICT. CTLR REPLY; 'NONE BUT COULD HAVE.' I RESPONDED 'WE HAVE NOT MOVED FROM OUR NON MOVEMENT AREA; HOW COULD WE HAVE POSSIBLY CONFLICTED WITH ANY TFC OR RWY INCURSION?' AFTER A VERY UNPRODUCTIVE DEBATE; I ASKED AGAIN IF ANY ACTION WAS TO BE TAKEN. THE CTLR IMPLIED NO ACTION WILL BE TAKEN. I THEN DEPARTED WITH NO FURTHER ISSUE. INQUIRED WITH UNION AS TO FOLLOW-UP. THEY REPLY NO ACTION TAKEN OR REQUIRED. IN SUMMARY: I INCORRECTLY THOUGHT A PDC WAS REQUIRED AND MADE THE FIRST CONTACT WITH THAT IN MIND; AS EXPERIENCED IN CLASS B OR CLASS C ARPTS. A MISTAKE ON THE CONSERVATIVE SIDE OF SAFETY. I WAS INCORRECT TO PWR DOWN RADIO FOR ENG START AS PER CHKLIST WITHOUT INDICATING TO CTLR. I WAS WRONGLY OUT OF COM FOR APPROX 2-4 MINS WITH EXECUTING THE BEFORE ENG START CHKLIST. THE CTLR USED POOR JUDGEMENT IN HIS UNPROFESSIONAL THREAT OF VIOLATION AND TONGUE LASHING OVER THE FREQ DEMONSTRATED A POOR UNDERSTANDING OF PLT CTLR RESPONSIBILITIES.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

C180 pilot in a non movement area on the airport called ground control for taxi information before starting engine. After engine start; the pilot called ground control for taxi and was threatened with a violation for not taxiing in a timely manner.