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A319 flight crew is questioned by ZLC regarding departure procedure used on jac departure resulting from failed ATC communication and confusing company information.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 668535 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200508 |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : jac.airport |
| State Reference | WY |
| Altitude | msl single value : 7000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zlc.artcc tower : jac.tower |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | A319 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | climbout : takeoff climbout : initial |
| Route In Use | departure sid : jac |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 20 flight time total : 3000 flight time type : 748 |
| ASRS Report | 668535 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 225 flight time total : 12000 flight time type : 2000 |
| ASRS Report | 668628 |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | non adherence : clearance other spatial deviation |
| Independent Detector | other controllera |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : detected after the fact |
| Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | Company ATC Human Performance |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
Narrative:
Took off from jac runway 19 and did the VFR 45 degree turn to avoid residential as cleared from jac tower; who specifically stated that we were cleared for VFR climb and 45 degree turn away from residential. We continued the VFR climb approximately toward mbw and contacted ZLC. ZLC stated that we needed to proceed to kickne on the teton as jac had not coordination a VFR climb. ZLC passed phone number for us to call on landing at denver. ZLC stated that this has been happening a lot lately with air carrier crews. The confusion lies 2 places. 1) the 10-7 page states that a VFR climb and 45 degree turn are acceptable and needed to be done with VFR climb. 2) we are cleared for the teton and slc is expecting us to proceed straight out on the radial to kickne -- the 2 points are in disagreement. Recommend to re-do the 10-7 page in coordination with ZLC personnel and make the statements more clear as to the expected action on departure.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A319 FLT CREW IS QUESTIONED BY ZLC REGARDING DEP PROC USED ON JAC DEP RESULTING FROM FAILED ATC COM AND CONFUSING COMPANY INFO.
Narrative: TOOK OFF FROM JAC RWY 19 AND DID THE VFR 45 DEG TURN TO AVOID RESIDENTIAL AS CLRED FROM JAC TWR; WHO SPECIFICALLY STATED THAT WE WERE CLRED FOR VFR CLB AND 45 DEG TURN AWAY FROM RESIDENTIAL. WE CONTINUED THE VFR CLB APPROX TOWARD MBW AND CONTACTED ZLC. ZLC STATED THAT WE NEEDED TO PROCEED TO KICKNE ON THE TETON AS JAC HAD NOT COORD A VFR CLB. ZLC PASSED PHONE NUMBER FOR US TO CALL ON LNDG AT DENVER. ZLC STATED THAT THIS HAS BEEN HAPPENING A LOT LATELY WITH ACR CREWS. THE CONFUSION LIES 2 PLACES. 1) THE 10-7 PAGE STATES THAT A VFR CLB AND 45 DEG TURN ARE ACCEPTABLE AND NEEDED TO BE DONE WITH VFR CLB. 2) WE ARE CLRED FOR THE TETON AND SLC IS EXPECTING US TO PROCEED STRAIGHT OUT ON THE RADIAL TO KICKNE -- THE 2 POINTS ARE IN DISAGREEMENT. RECOMMEND TO RE-DO THE 10-7 PAGE IN COORD WITH ZLC PERSONNEL AND MAKE THE STATEMENTS MORE CLR AS TO THE EXPECTED ACTION ON DEP.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.