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ZOB controller experienced operational error at FL240 and expressed concern regarding existing LOA procedures with ZID.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 654569 |
| Time | |
| Date | 200504 |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | navaid : fdy.vortac |
| State Reference | OH |
| Altitude | msl single value : 24000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zob.artcc |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | EMB ERJ 135 ER&LR |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | climbout : intermediate altitude |
| Route In Use | departure : on vectors |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zob.artcc |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | EMB ERJ 145 ER&LR |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | descent : intermediate altitude |
| Route In Use | arrival star : wakem |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | government : faa |
| Function | controller : radar |
| Qualification | controller : radar |
| Experience | controller radar : 7 |
| ASRS Report | 654569 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : required legal separation |
| Independent Detector | atc equipment : conflict alert other controllera |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued alert |
| Consequence | faa : investigated |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 23400 vertical : 500 |
| Supplementary | |
| Problem Areas | ATC Human Performance Airspace Structure |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | Operational Error |
Narrative:
RJ135 climbing dtw vwv ape to FL290 heading 190 degrees. E145 cruise at FL240 nebound (wakem arrival to cle). LOA should be changed for aircraft over rod wakem cle to be at or below FL230. It is complex and difficult to climb dtw departures above cle arrs at times. ZOB has asked ZID to change this for yrs; but refused. I'm afraid it would only take a midair to change this procedure.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ZOB CTLR EXPERIENCED OPERROR AT FL240 AND EXPRESSED CONCERN REGARDING EXISTING LOA PROCS WITH ZID.
Narrative: RJ135 CLBING DTW VWV APE TO FL290 HDG 190 DEGS. E145 CRUISE AT FL240 NEBOUND (WAKEM ARR TO CLE). LOA SHOULD BE CHANGED FOR ACFT OVER ROD WAKEM CLE TO BE AT OR BELOW FL230. IT IS COMPLEX AND DIFFICULT TO CLB DTW DEPS ABOVE CLE ARRS AT TIMES. ZOB HAS ASKED ZID TO CHANGE THIS FOR YRS; BUT REFUSED. I'M AFRAID IT WOULD ONLY TAKE A MIDAIR TO CHANGE THIS PROC.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.