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Flight crew of an light transport question the reference point from which to use in the descent clearance since the controller's phraseology was very vague.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 397050 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199803 |
| Day | Tue |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | airport : otk |
| State Reference | GA |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 7000 msl bound upper : 12000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | IMC |
| Light | Night |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : vad |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Light Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turboprop Eng |
| Flight Phase | descent other |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp pilot : cfi |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 250 flight time total : 4800 |
| ASRS Report | 397050 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | none taken : unable |
| Consequence | Other |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | ATC Human Performance |
| Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
Descending through about 12000 ft MSL we were cleared 'cross 15 mi south at 7000 ft.' we queried the controller, '15 mi south of what?' he told us to cross 15 mi south of our position when we got the original clearance. If his wording was legal, it shouldn't be. Both pilots in the airplane were confused.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLC OF AN LTT QUESTION THE REF POINT FROM WHICH TO USE IN THE DSCNT CLRNC SINCE THE CTLR'S PHRASEOLOGY WAS VERY VAGUE.
Narrative: DSNDING THROUGH ABOUT 12000 FT MSL WE WERE CLRED 'CROSS 15 MI S AT 7000 FT.' WE QUERIED THE CTLR, '15 MI S OF WHAT?' HE TOLD US TO CROSS 15 MI S OF OUR POS WHEN WE GOT THE ORIGINAL CLRNC. IF HIS WORDING WAS LEGAL, IT SHOULDN'T BE. BOTH PLTS IN THE AIRPLANE WERE CONFUSED.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.