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37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
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A controller reports that TCASII limitations can cause them to indicate a traffic conflict in some cases that would not be conflicts if the potential intruder performs as planned.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 347316 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199609 |
| Day | Thu |
| Local Time Of Day | 0601 To 1200 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : ocn |
| State Reference | CA |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 12000 msl bound upper : 13000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | tracon : san |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | cruise other |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Operator | other |
| Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Navigation In Use | Other Other |
| Flight Phase | cruise other |
| Flight Plan | DVR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | government : faa |
| Function | controller : approach |
| Qualification | controller : radar |
| Experience | controller radar : 8 |
| ASRS Report | 347316 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | aircraft equipment other aircraft equipment : unspecified other controllera other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | flight crew : took evasive action |
| Consequence | Other |
| Miss Distance | horizontal : 42000 |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Aircraft |
| Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
It has been explained to me by first level supervisor that we no longer submit TCASII report forms since TCASII is now a 'success.' hence this complaint. XXX air carrier was a lax arrival on the vista 1 arrival over ocn at 12000 ft. Restr area R2503 was hot with numerous fighters operating between 5000 ft and 15000 ft. Keep in mind these fighters were operating at speeds close to 630 mph while climbing and descending rapidly. XXX received a TCASII resolution to climb from 12000 ft to 13000 ft. Those aircraft were never closer than 7 mi. That is the problem with TCASII, it does not differentiate between relevant, and irrelevant traffic. Now that so many more aircraft are classified in the small category, I maintain that TCASII will definitely be responsible for more losses of separation. I believe that sooner or later some B757 will respond to his TCASII advisory, descend, and therefore put some poor sap into his wake, causing a catastrophe. Just a word of warning.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A CTLR RPTS THAT TCASII LIMITATIONS CAN CAUSE THEM TO INDICATE A TFC CONFLICT IN SOME CASES THAT WOULD NOT BE CONFLICTS IF THE POTENTIAL INTRUDER PERFORMS AS PLANNED.
Narrative: IT HAS BEEN EXPLAINED TO ME BY FIRST LEVEL SUPVR THAT WE NO LONGER SUBMIT TCASII RPT FORMS SINCE TCASII IS NOW A 'SUCCESS.' HENCE THIS COMPLAINT. XXX ACR WAS A LAX ARR ON THE VISTA 1 ARR OVER OCN AT 12000 FT. RESTR AREA R2503 WAS HOT WITH NUMEROUS FIGHTERS OPERATING BTWN 5000 FT AND 15000 FT. KEEP IN MIND THESE FIGHTERS WERE OPERATING AT SPDS CLOSE TO 630 MPH WHILE CLBING AND DSNDING RAPIDLY. XXX RECEIVED A TCASII RESOLUTION TO CLB FROM 12000 FT TO 13000 FT. THOSE ACFT WERE NEVER CLOSER THAN 7 MI. THAT IS THE PROB WITH TCASII, IT DOES NOT DIFFERENTIATE BTWN RELEVANT, AND IRRELEVANT TFC. NOW THAT SO MANY MORE ACFT ARE CLASSIFIED IN THE SMALL CATEGORY, I MAINTAIN THAT TCASII WILL DEFINITELY BE RESPONSIBLE FOR MORE LOSSES OF SEPARATION. I BELIEVE THAT SOONER OR LATER SOME B757 WILL RESPOND TO HIS TCASII ADVISORY, DSND, AND THEREFORE PUT SOME POOR SAP INTO HIS WAKE, CAUSING A CATASTROPHE. JUST A WORD OF WARNING.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.