Poor coordination between military TRACON and FAA TRACON and ARTCC causes less than standard separat...

Attributes
ACN	169162
Time
Date	199101
Day	Fri
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	airport : suu
State Reference	CA
Altitude	msl bound lower : 9500 msl bound upper : 10000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : suu
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Small Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turboprop Eng
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Route In Use	enroute airway : zoa enroute airway : sck
Flight Plan	IFR
Aircraft 2
Operator	other
Make Model Name	Military Transport
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	government : faa
Function	controller : flight data
Qualification	controller : radar
Experience	controller radar : 18
ASRS Report	169162
Person 2
Affiliation	government : faa
Function	controller : radar
Qualification	controller : radar
Events
Anomaly	conflict : airborne less severe non adherence : published procedure non adherence : required legal separation
Independent Detector	atc equipment other atc equipment : unspecified other controllera
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance
Consequence	Other
Miss Distance	horizontal : 18000 vertical : 0
Supplementary
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	Operational Error

Narrative:

Reporter was working D-24 suu approach called with a handoff. I answered the line and asked if it was small transport X (not sure of call sign) over oakey intersection. Suu said no, handoff on mlt X (not sure of call sign) 5 east of travis. I observed limited data block and mentioned that aircraft had not been departed. I took radar on mlt X climbing to 10000'. I got off the line, departed the aircraft and started track. I immediately became aware of the conflict with small transport X climbing to 10000' on V334 northbound over sac. We weren't talking to either aircraft. Within 5 seconds of taking handoff on mlt Y I called suu back and offered higher altitude on mlt Y. They sounded hesitant on interphone and said they shipped the aircraft to sector 24. Mlt Y still wasn't on frequency, but small transport X checked on frequency climbing to 10000'. Right 24 controller told small transport X to maintain present altitude. Small transport X was between 9000-10000'. Mlt Y was at 10000'. I again called suu and advised we weren't talking to mlt Y and that he had small transport X traffic climbing to 10000' climb and maintenance 15000'. Suu responded they shipped the mlt Y. Mlt Y came over at 10000'. R-24 climbed mlt Y and asked him to expedite climb through 11000' report level. Sep was lost. Apparently suu approach made a late point-out to sck approach. Sck advised unable point-out because of their traffic small transport X climbing to 10000'.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: POOR COORD BETWEEN MIL TRACON AND FAA TRACON AND ARTCC CAUSES LESS THAN STANDARD SEPARATION PROBLEM WITH SMT AND MLT CLIMBING TO SAME ALT ON CONVERGING COURSES.

Narrative: RPTR WAS WORKING D-24 SUU APCH CALLED WITH A HDOF. I ANSWERED THE LINE AND ASKED IF IT WAS SMT X (NOT SURE OF CALL SIGN) OVER OAKEY INTXN. SUU SAID NO, HDOF ON MLT X (NOT SURE OF CALL SIGN) 5 E OF TRAVIS. I OBSERVED LIMITED DATA BLOCK AND MENTIONED THAT ACFT HAD NOT BEEN DEPARTED. I TOOK RADAR ON MLT X CLBING TO 10000'. I GOT OFF THE LINE, DEPARTED THE ACFT AND STARTED TRACK. I IMMEDIATELY BECAME AWARE OF THE CONFLICT WITH SMT X CLBING TO 10000' ON V334 NBND OVER SAC. WE WEREN'T TALKING TO EITHER ACFT. WITHIN 5 SECS OF TAKING HDOF ON MLT Y I CALLED SUU BACK AND OFFERED HIGHER ALT ON MLT Y. THEY SOUNDED HESITANT ON INTERPHONE AND SAID THEY SHIPPED THE ACFT TO SECTOR 24. MLT Y STILL WASN'T ON FREQ, BUT SMT X CHKED ON FREQ CLBING TO 10000'. R 24 CTLR TOLD SMT X TO MAINTAIN PRESENT ALT. SMT X WAS BTWN 9000-10000'. MLT Y WAS AT 10000'. I AGAIN CALLED SUU AND ADVISED WE WEREN'T TALKING TO MLT Y AND THAT HE HAD SMT X TFC CLBING TO 10000' CLB AND MAINT 15000'. SUU RESPONDED THEY SHIPPED THE MLT Y. MLT Y CAME OVER AT 10000'. R-24 CLBED MLT Y AND ASKED HIM TO EXPEDITE CLB THROUGH 11000' RPT LEVEL. SEP WAS LOST. APPARENTLY SUU APCH MADE A LATE POINT-OUT TO SCK APCH. SCK ADVISED UNABLE POINT-OUT BECAUSE OF THEIR TFC SMT X CLBING TO 10000'.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

Poor coordination between military TRACON and FAA TRACON and ARTCC causes less than standard separation problem with small transport and mlt climbing to same altitude on converging courses.