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Large transport flight crew instructed to do a three sixty degree turn at intersection which they had already passed by the time it was located on the chart.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 126402 |
| Time | |
| Date | 198910 |
| Day | Thu |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : tvt |
| State Reference | OH |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 11000 msl bound upper : 11000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng |
| Flight Phase | cruise other |
| Route In Use | enroute airway : zob |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 180 flight time total : 17860 flight time type : 6893 |
| ASRS Report | 126402 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | other anomaly other other spatial deviation |
| Independent Detector | other controllera other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | controller : issued new clearance |
| Consequence | faa : reviewed incident with flight crew |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
| Air Traffic Incident | other |
Narrative:
ZOB claims we were given holding instructions as ritzs which all 3 crew members agree we did not get. The ATC controller told us to make a 360 degree turn at ritzs intersection and by the time we looked it up in the map we were already a couple of mi past it. At that time the controller came on and said 'did you start your turn yet'? We replied 'we're starting it right now'. Nothing else was mentioned until we landed at cle and the ground controller asked us to call them on the landline. We believe the ATC people were too late in issuing the clearance for a 360 degree turn and should allow themselves and us more distance to issue any clearance.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: LGT FLT CREW INSTRUCTED TO DO A THREE SIXTY DEGREE TURN AT INTXN WHICH THEY HAD ALREADY PASSED BY THE TIME IT WAS LOCATED ON THE CHART.
Narrative: ZOB CLAIMS WE WERE GIVEN HOLDING INSTRUCTIONS AS RITZS WHICH ALL 3 CREW MEMBERS AGREE WE DID NOT GET. THE ATC CTLR TOLD US TO MAKE A 360 DEG TURN AT RITZS INTXN AND BY THE TIME WE LOOKED IT UP IN THE MAP WE WERE ALREADY A COUPLE OF MI PAST IT. AT THAT TIME THE CTLR CAME ON AND SAID 'DID YOU START YOUR TURN YET'? WE REPLIED 'WE'RE STARTING IT RIGHT NOW'. NOTHING ELSE WAS MENTIONED UNTIL WE LANDED AT CLE AND THE GND CTLR ASKED US TO CALL THEM ON THE LANDLINE. WE BELIEVE THE ATC PEOPLE WERE TOO LATE IN ISSUING THE CLRNC FOR A 360 DEG TURN AND SHOULD ALLOW THEMSELVES AND US MORE DISTANCE TO ISSUE ANY CLRNC.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.