Narrative:

In 25 years and 3 months of IFR airline flying; I have never before until this flight today; been issued a clearance to climb to and maintain a VFR altitude. We leveled at our initially cleared altitude of 4;000 ft on departure frequency; and were then issued climb to 8;500 ft. I said; 'please repeat altitude' and the controller repeated; '8;500.' I said; 'that's a VFR altitude.' he stated; 'yes it is.' my first officer and a jumpseating fellow captain agreed with me that it was unprecedented to be issued a clearance to level at a VFR altitude under IFR in a large 121 jet transport. I stated that it did not sound safe to us and the controller flippantly said; 'are you flying the airplane or controlling the traffic today?' it is obviously a captain's responsibility to question any clearance which he or she believes to be unsafe or not in compliance with standard procedures and regulations. He then asked us to read back our altitude and I read back; 'XXX 123 cleared to 8;500.' we did not have to level off; because climbing through approximately 7;500 ft; the controller said; 'traffic no factor; climb to 16;000.' he then said; 'the reason I was leveling you at 8;500 is because you would have gotten a TCAS RA with that other traffic;' to which I replied; 'we could have leveled at any other altitude below that traffic.' the most obvious example would have been a clearance to 8;000 ft. He could have vectored us around him; as the traffic level was extremely light overall. He then stated; 'you are in class B airspace.' a look at that chart shows that class B terminates 30 DME west of iah; which of course we are closing in on pretty rapidly in a jet; if the frequency gets tied up and the controller leaves us at 8;500 ft; we could easily overtake all kinds of light aircraft just outside the class B. Just as importantly as the non-standard altitude; was the initial attitude of the controller that his clearance to level at a VFR altitude was beyond questioning. To use an extreme example; I will question and I will not accept a vector clearance into the side of a mountain either. I had an incredibly close near miss with a light aircraft in a heavy jet on a new york area arrival; and I do not wish to ever be level at light VFR aircraft cruise altitudes; even in class B airspace; which such aircraft occasional blunder into.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: An I90 Controller issued an air carrier a climb to 8;500 FT during its departure climb which the Captain took issue with because he did not want to level at a low VFR altitude.

Narrative: In 25 years and 3 months of IFR airline flying; I have never before until this flight today; been issued a clearance to climb to and maintain a VFR altitude. We leveled at our initially cleared altitude of 4;000 FT on Departure frequency; and were then issued climb to 8;500 FT. I said; 'Please repeat altitude' and the Controller repeated; '8;500.' I said; 'That's a VFR altitude.' He stated; 'Yes it is.' My First Officer and a jumpseating fellow Captain agreed with me that it was unprecedented to be issued a clearance to level at a VFR altitude under IFR in a large 121 jet transport. I stated that it did not sound safe to us and the Controller flippantly said; 'Are you flying the airplane or controlling the traffic today?' It is obviously a Captain's responsibility to question any clearance which he or she believes to be unsafe or not in compliance with standard procedures and regulations. He then asked us to read back our altitude and I read back; 'XXX 123 cleared to 8;500.' We did not have to level off; because climbing through approximately 7;500 FT; the Controller said; 'Traffic no factor; climb to 16;000.' He then said; 'The reason I was leveling you at 8;500 is because you would have gotten a TCAS RA with that other traffic;' to which I replied; 'We could have leveled at any other altitude below that traffic.' The most obvious example would have been a clearance to 8;000 FT. He could have vectored us around him; as the traffic level was extremely light overall. He then stated; 'You are in Class B airspace.' A look at that chart shows that Class B terminates 30 DME west of IAH; which of course we are closing in on pretty rapidly in a jet; if the frequency gets tied up and the controller leaves us at 8;500 FT; we could easily overtake all kinds of light aircraft just outside the Class B. Just as importantly as the non-standard altitude; was the initial attitude of the controller that his clearance to level at a VFR altitude was beyond questioning. To use an extreme example; I will question and I will not accept a vector clearance into the side of a mountain either. I had an incredibly close near miss with a light aircraft in a heavy jet on a New York area arrival; and I do not wish to ever be level at light VFR aircraft cruise altitudes; even in Class B airspace; which such aircraft occasional blunder into.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.