Potential conflict between 2 air carrier-large transport on departures.

Attributes
ACN	98951
Time
Date	198811
Day	Sun
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	airport : lax
State Reference	CA
Altitude	msl bound lower : 4000 msl bound upper : 5000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : lax
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Large Transport, Low Wing, 2 Turbojet Eng
Navigation In Use	Other Other
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Route In Use	approach : visual departure sid : sid enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Aircraft 2
Operator	common carrier : air carrier
Make Model Name	Large Transport, Low Wing, 3 Turbojet Eng
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Route In Use	departure sid : sid enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	IFR
Person 1
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp pilot : flight engineer
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 14000 flight time type : 1100
ASRS Report	98951
Person 2
Affiliation	company : air carrier
Function	flight crew : captain oversight : pic
Qualification	pilot : atp
Events
Anomaly	conflict : airborne less severe other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	flight crew : took evasive action
Consequence	faa : reviewed incident with flight crew
Miss Distance	horizontal : 12000 vertical : 1000
Supplementary
Primary Problem	ATC Human Performance
Air Traffic Incident	other

Narrative:

An large transport took off 1 min prior to us on runway 25R at lax. We were cleared for takeoff with a clearance to maintain 2000' on heading 220 degrees at the shoreline by lax tower. After switch to departure control we were cleared to maintain 4000' with advisory that large transport off our right was at 5000'. Departure then asked us if we had large transport visually, which we did. They told us to maintain visual on large transport and we were cleared to resume the flipper departure, maintain 13000'. I thought large transport was turning right (north) but instead they were turning over the top and behind us and I could not keep them in sight and fly the departure as cleared. I leveled at 5000' and let large transport pass over and behind us. I never did see large transport again and we resumed our climb after enough time for large transport to clear. We were never within 1000' of large transport. We told departure control that they created a conflict. Looking at the event now I probably should not have accepted the VFR clearance, but departure should have realized they were creating a problem because of the different aircraft types and climb rates.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: POTENTIAL CONFLICT BETWEEN 2 ACR-LGT ON DEPS.

Narrative: AN LGT TOOK OFF 1 MIN PRIOR TO US ON RWY 25R AT LAX. WE WERE CLRED FOR TKOF WITH A CLRNC TO MAINTAIN 2000' ON HDG 220 DEGS AT THE SHORELINE BY LAX TWR. AFTER SWITCH TO DEP CTL WE WERE CLRED TO MAINTAIN 4000' WITH ADVISORY THAT LGT OFF OUR RIGHT WAS AT 5000'. DEP THEN ASKED US IF WE HAD LGT VISUALLY, WHICH WE DID. THEY TOLD US TO MAINTAIN VISUAL ON LGT AND WE WERE CLRED TO RESUME THE FLIPPER DEP, MAINTAIN 13000'. I THOUGHT LGT WAS TURNING RIGHT (N) BUT INSTEAD THEY WERE TURNING OVER THE TOP AND BEHIND US AND I COULD NOT KEEP THEM IN SIGHT AND FLY THE DEP AS CLRED. I LEVELED AT 5000' AND LET LGT PASS OVER AND BEHIND US. I NEVER DID SEE LGT AGAIN AND WE RESUMED OUR CLB AFTER ENOUGH TIME FOR LGT TO CLR. WE WERE NEVER WITHIN 1000' OF LGT. WE TOLD DEP CTL THAT THEY CREATED A CONFLICT. LOOKING AT THE EVENT NOW I PROBABLY SHOULD NOT HAVE ACCEPTED THE VFR CLRNC, BUT DEP SHOULD HAVE REALIZED THEY WERE CREATING A PROB BECAUSE OF THE DIFFERENT ACFT TYPES AND CLB RATES.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.