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A lax ATC ground controller reported the conflict which develops when ramp controllers allow aircraft into a congested ramp area without communicating. An air carrier crew describe the same event in the crew's view and reported there was no conflict because ramp pushed the only other aircraft clear of the inbound aircraft's gate.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 950171 |
| Time | |
| Date | 201105 |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201-1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | LAX.Airport |
| State Reference | CA |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Make Model Name | B757 Undifferentiated or Other Model |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | Taxi |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Aircraft 2 | |
| Make Model Name | B757-200 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | Taxi |
| Route In Use | None |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Function | Ground |
| Qualification | Air Traffic Control Fully Certified |
| Experience | Air Traffic Control Non Radar 17 |
| Person 2 | |
| Function | Pilot Not Flying First Officer |
| Experience | Flight Crew Last 90 Days 100 Flight Crew Total 13000 Flight Crew Type 921 |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | ATC Issue All Types |
Narrative:
An air carrier; the first to taxi in; was instructed to hold short of C7 for an outbound aircraft. Another air carrier behind the first was told to taxi to the gate but that aircraft could not move until the first aircraft waited for the outbound flight to taxi out and then started his taxi in. I noticed the first aircraft had made a right turn towards their alley. I stopped them and asked what was happening. They stated that the ramp tower had cleared them in. The ramp tower claimed otherwise. I could have been pushing off one of the tangential gates and a possible incident could have occurred. Lax has had innumerable similar incidents and I have reported some of my personal occurrences. Last night a very similar yet more dangerous event happened. The ramp towers at lax; all of them; need to cease operation immediately; before we have an accident. The ramp tower usefulness and frequency congestion relief went away after 9/11. Lax tower can provide a safer more efficient operation.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: A LAX ATC Ground Controller reported the conflict which develops when Ramp Controllers allow aircraft into a congested ramp area without communicating. An Air Carrier crew describe the same event in the crew's view and reported there was no conflict because Ramp pushed the only other aircraft clear of the inbound aircraft's gate.
Narrative: An Air Carrier; the first to taxi in; was instructed to hold short of C7 for an outbound aircraft. Another Air Carrier behind the first was told to taxi to the gate but that aircraft could not move until the first aircraft waited for the outbound flight to taxi out and then started his taxi in. I noticed the first aircraft had made a right turn towards their alley. I stopped them and asked what was happening. They stated that the Ramp Tower had cleared them in. The Ramp Tower claimed otherwise. I could have been pushing off one of the tangential gates and a possible incident could have occurred. LAX has had innumerable similar incidents and I have reported some of my personal occurrences. Last night a very similar yet more dangerous event happened. The Ramp Towers at LAX; all of them; need to cease operation immediately; before we have an accident. The Ramp Tower usefulness and frequency congestion relief went away after 9/11. LAX Tower can provide a safer more efficient operation.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of April 2012 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.