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An air carrier first officer was confused by the SID and RNAV fixes which contained two altitudes; one annotated 'ATC' and the other not annotated. Clearance delivery was initially uncertain also; but then directed the non annotated altitude was correct. The FMC correctly uploaded the ATC altitude constraints.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 912545 |
| Time | |
| Date | 201010 |
| Local Time Of Day | 0001-0600 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | LAX.Airport |
| State Reference | CA |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | Parked |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Component | |
| Aircraft Component | Aero Charts |
| Person 1 | |
| Function | First Officer |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | Deviation - Procedural Published Material / Policy |
Narrative:
Flying out of las and lax [on this] last trip; the captain and I noticed the RNAV SID's contained altitude restriction labels we were not familiar with. Some fixes had 2 altitudes to comply with; one was just an altitude and the other had the designation (ATC) beside it. The FMC up linked the (ATC) altitudes. We asked clearance delivery which altitudes to use and he wasn't sure either. He had to ask a supervisor. They said we were the 20th crew that week to ask about it. Their answer was that we are to use the un-annotated altitude; which was different than what up linked in the FMC. So we had to edit all of those altitudes. It is very confusing and could lead to a violation or worse. The pages in question are las: boach 3 and shead 6. Lax: loop 5 and sebby 5.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: An air carrier First Officer was confused by the SID and RNAV fixes which contained two altitudes; one annotated 'ATC' and the other not annotated. Clearance Delivery was initially uncertain also; but then directed the non annotated altitude was correct. The FMC correctly uploaded the ATC altitude constraints.
Narrative: Flying out of LAS and LAX [on this] last trip; the Captain and I noticed the RNAV SID's contained altitude restriction labels we were not familiar with. Some fixes had 2 altitudes to comply with; one was just an altitude and the other had the designation (ATC) beside it. The FMC up linked the (ATC) altitudes. We asked Clearance Delivery which altitudes to use and he wasn't sure either. He had to ask a Supervisor. They said we were the 20th crew that week to ask about it. Their answer was that we are to use the un-annotated altitude; which was different than what up linked in the FMC. So we had to edit all of those altitudes. It is very confusing and could lead to a violation or worse. The pages in question are LAS: BOACH 3 and SHEAD 6. LAX: LOOP 5 and SEBBY 5.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of April 2012 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.