A new student working with an instructor on his first cross country deviated from cleared altitude w...

Attributes
ACN	716048
Time
Date	200611
Local Time Of Day	0601 To 1200
Place
Locale Reference	airport : far.airport
State Reference	ND
Altitude	msl single value : 5000
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : far.tracon
Operator	general aviation : personal
Make Model Name	PA-28 Cherokee/Archer II/Dakota/Pillan/Warrior
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 91
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Flight Plan	VFR
Person 1
Affiliation	other
Function	instruction : instructor
Qualification	pilot : cfi pilot : commercial pilot : instrument pilot : multi engine pilot : private pilot : student
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 90 flight time total : 340 flight time type : 288
ASRS Report	716048
Person 2
Affiliation	other
Function	instruction : trainee
Events
Anomaly	altitude deviation : excursion from assigned altitude non adherence : clearance
Independent Detector	other controllera other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	flight crew : returned to assigned altitude
Consequence	faa : reviewed incident with flight crew
Supplementary
Problem Areas	Flight Crew Human Performance
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance

Narrative:

I took my private student out on his first cross country from grand forks; nd; to jamestown; nd; to fargo; nd; and back to grand forks; nd. The trip was uneventful; the WX was perfect for a VFR cross country. We had high ceilings and good visibility so visual separation wasn't a problem. When we took off out of fargo on runway 9; on departure we were given a heading of 040 degrees to maintain and climb to 4500 ft. Shortly after we were cleared on course. Meanwhile I wanted to show my student how to open and close flight plans. I requested a temporary frequency change from the fargo TRSA's departure to the FSS; which was granted and we were instructed to report back when on frequency. We switched over to the FSS frequency to open our flight plan. After the flight plan was opened we advised departure we were back on his frequency. The radio was silent and I started wondering 2 things either our radio has failed or we are outside of the TRSA. I looked at the frequency and it was correct; then I looked down at the sectional chart to verify we were still in the TRSA's airspace. I confirmed we were still in the airspace and by that time my student was still climbing through our assigned altitude of 4500 ft and we were at an altitude of 5000 ft by then. I told my student we needed to get back down to our assigned altitude and at that time the controller stated radar contact; then asked us to state altitude. We were obviously 500 ft high and descending back to our originally assigned altitude. I told him 5000 ft and he advised us of our previously assigned altitude. I learned a lot from this situation which will better my instruction. First off; it was my student's first time operating in a TRSA and he was unclr of which altitude he should climb to since we heard no response from ATC. I know now that a student may be in question even when they don't ask questions. Second; I learned that we could have waited to open the flight plan after we were out of the TRSA's airspace in order to reduce our pilot workload. I also learned that I need to keep a closer watch on the student's altitude.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: A NEW STUDENT WORKING WITH AN INSTRUCTOR ON HIS FIRST XCOUNTRY DEVIATED FROM CLRED ALT WHEN THEY WERE DISTR OPENING THEIR CLRNC WITH FSS.

Narrative: I TOOK MY PVT STUDENT OUT ON HIS FIRST XCOUNTRY FROM GRAND FORKS; ND; TO JAMESTOWN; ND; TO FARGO; ND; AND BACK TO GRAND FORKS; ND. THE TRIP WAS UNEVENTFUL; THE WX WAS PERFECT FOR A VFR XCOUNTRY. WE HAD HIGH CEILINGS AND GOOD VISIBILITY SO VISUAL SEPARATION WASN'T A PROB. WHEN WE TOOK OFF OUT OF FARGO ON RWY 9; ON DEP WE WERE GIVEN A HDG OF 040 DEGS TO MAINTAIN AND CLB TO 4500 FT. SHORTLY AFTER WE WERE CLRED ON COURSE. MEANWHILE I WANTED TO SHOW MY STUDENT HOW TO OPEN AND CLOSE FLT PLANS. I REQUESTED A TEMPORARY FREQ CHANGE FROM THE FARGO TRSA'S DEP TO THE FSS; WHICH WAS GRANTED AND WE WERE INSTRUCTED TO RPT BACK WHEN ON FREQ. WE SWITCHED OVER TO THE FSS FREQ TO OPEN OUR FLT PLAN. AFTER THE FLT PLAN WAS OPENED WE ADVISED DEP WE WERE BACK ON HIS FREQ. THE RADIO WAS SILENT AND I STARTED WONDERING 2 THINGS EITHER OUR RADIO HAS FAILED OR WE ARE OUTSIDE OF THE TRSA. I LOOKED AT THE FREQ AND IT WAS CORRECT; THEN I LOOKED DOWN AT THE SECTIONAL CHART TO VERIFY WE WERE STILL IN THE TRSA'S AIRSPACE. I CONFIRMED WE WERE STILL IN THE AIRSPACE AND BY THAT TIME MY STUDENT WAS STILL CLBING THROUGH OUR ASSIGNED ALT OF 4500 FT AND WE WERE AT AN ALT OF 5000 FT BY THEN. I TOLD MY STUDENT WE NEEDED TO GET BACK DOWN TO OUR ASSIGNED ALT AND AT THAT TIME THE CTLR STATED RADAR CONTACT; THEN ASKED US TO STATE ALT. WE WERE OBVIOUSLY 500 FT HIGH AND DSNDING BACK TO OUR ORIGINALLY ASSIGNED ALT. I TOLD HIM 5000 FT AND HE ADVISED US OF OUR PREVIOUSLY ASSIGNED ALT. I LEARNED A LOT FROM THIS SITUATION WHICH WILL BETTER MY INSTRUCTION. FIRST OFF; IT WAS MY STUDENT'S FIRST TIME OPERATING IN A TRSA AND HE WAS UNCLR OF WHICH ALT HE SHOULD CLB TO SINCE WE HEARD NO RESPONSE FROM ATC. I KNOW NOW THAT A STUDENT MAY BE IN QUESTION EVEN WHEN THEY DON'T ASK QUESTIONS. SECOND; I LEARNED THAT WE COULD HAVE WAITED TO OPEN THE FLT PLAN AFTER WE WERE OUT OF THE TRSA'S AIRSPACE IN ORDER TO REDUCE OUR PLT WORKLOAD. I ALSO LEARNED THAT I NEED TO KEEP A CLOSER WATCH ON THE STUDENT'S ALT.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of January 2009 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

A new student working with an instructor on his first cross country deviated from cleared altitude when they were distraction opening their clearance with FSS.