Near midair collision between a PA28 climbing out on the downwind leg of an uncontrolled airport and...

Attributes
ACN	542244
Time
Date	200205
Day	Sun
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	airport : 069.airport
State Reference	CA
Altitude	msl single value : 1400
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Operator	general aviation : personal
Make Model Name	PA-28 Cherokee/Archer II/Dakota/Pillan/Warrior
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 91
Flight Phase	climbout : intermediate altitude
Route In Use	departure other
Flight Plan	None
Aircraft 2
Operator	general aviation : personal
Make Model Name	Baron 55/Cochise
Operating Under FAR Part	Part 91
Flight Phase	descent : approach
Route In Use	approach : traffic pattern
Flight Plan	None
Person 1
Affiliation	other
Function	flight crew : single pilot
Qualification	pilot : private pilot : instrument
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 12 flight time total : 500 flight time type : 400
ASRS Report	542244
Person 2
Affiliation	other
Function	flight crew : single pilot
Events
Anomaly	conflict : nmac other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	flight crew : took evasive action
Consequence	Other
Miss Distance	horizontal : 0 vertical : 500
Supplementary
Problem Areas	Flight Crew Human Performance
Primary Problem	Flight Crew Human Performance

Narrative:

Our aircraft was on a downwind departure which we had announced on CTAF. The baron was approaching the airport and announced a 2 mi 45 degree position. We were looking for traffic and were above pattern altitude so were surprised to see the baron above and approaching. We assumed he was descending to pattern altitude and could not see us (both assumptions apparently correct given our later radio exchange) and initiated a descent. While altering our flight path to separate the airplanes horizontal. He passed well over us but apparently saw us afterwards and was shaken up. He addressed us on the radio and asked us where we thought we were going. I replied 'we're departing the pattern on downwind.' he inquired if we had seen him and I replied in the affirmative. He then advised me I should have made a radio call. Not wanting to discuss the particulars on a congested frequency, I replied that I had advised my intentions. He replied, 'that's fine if you want to end up dead!' I would have liked to explain to him that once I saw him I was busy altering my course and descending, and didn't prioritize using the radio. Had I called my turn to downwind it would have been better for us. I concede, I did not. However, expect a pilot calling in on the 45 degrees to be 1000 ft or more above pattern altitude. I believe we had adequate separation but regret upsetting the other pilot, and once we had passed I probably should have called him first. It is always tricky to decide how much radio is enough in a congested frequency setting.

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: NMAC BTWN A PA28 CLBING OUT ON THE DOWNWIND LEG OF AN UNCTLED ARPT AND A BEECH BARON ENTERING THE PATTERN ON A 45 DEGS TO DOWNWIND LEG 1000 FT ABOVE THE PATTERN ALT.

Narrative: OUR ACFT WAS ON A DOWNWIND DEP WHICH WE HAD ANNOUNCED ON CTAF. THE BARON WAS APCHING THE ARPT AND ANNOUNCED A 2 MI 45 DEG POS. WE WERE LOOKING FOR TFC AND WERE ABOVE PATTERN ALT SO WERE SURPRISED TO SEE THE BARON ABOVE AND APCHING. WE ASSUMED HE WAS DSNDING TO PATTERN ALT AND COULD NOT SEE US (BOTH ASSUMPTIONS APPARENTLY CORRECT GIVEN OUR LATER RADIO EXCHANGE) AND INITIATED A DSCNT. WHILE ALTERING OUR FLT PATH TO SEPARATE THE AIRPLANES HORIZ. HE PASSED WELL OVER US BUT APPARENTLY SAW US AFTERWARDS AND WAS SHAKEN UP. HE ADDRESSED US ON THE RADIO AND ASKED US WHERE WE THOUGHT WE WERE GOING. I REPLIED 'WE'RE DEPARTING THE PATTERN ON DOWNWIND.' HE INQUIRED IF WE HAD SEEN HIM AND I REPLIED IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. HE THEN ADVISED ME I SHOULD HAVE MADE A RADIO CALL. NOT WANTING TO DISCUSS THE PARTICULARS ON A CONGESTED FREQ, I REPLIED THAT I HAD ADVISED MY INTENTIONS. HE REPLIED, 'THAT'S FINE IF YOU WANT TO END UP DEAD!' I WOULD HAVE LIKED TO EXPLAIN TO HIM THAT ONCE I SAW HIM I WAS BUSY ALTERING MY COURSE AND DSNDING, AND DIDN'T PRIORITIZE USING THE RADIO. HAD I CALLED MY TURN TO DOWNWIND IT WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER FOR US. I CONCEDE, I DID NOT. HOWEVER, EXPECT A PLT CALLING IN ON THE 45 DEGS TO BE 1000 FT OR MORE ABOVE PATTERN ALT. I BELIEVE WE HAD ADEQUATE SEPARATION BUT REGRET UPSETTING THE OTHER PLT, AND ONCE WE HAD PASSED I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE CALLED HIM FIRST. IT IS ALWAYS TRICKY TO DECIDE HOW MUCH RADIO IS ENOUGH IN A CONGESTED FREQ SETTING.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.

Near midair collision between a PA28 climbing out on the downwind leg of an uncontrolled airport and a beech baron entering the pattern on a 45 degrees to downwind leg 1000 ft above the pattern altitude.