Narrative:

ZLA had cleared us to cross 10 mi northwest of pmd at FL240, then maintain FL230. Due to traffic, this was changed to maintain FL270. When east of pmd, and clear of traffic, ZLA cleared us to cross hitop at 13000 ft. We put hitop as the next fix in the FMC and began descent at 280 KTS. We took this to mean also that we were cleared direct to hitop. This deleted majek expect to cross at 14000 ft, and cross at 250 KTS restr in the FMC. The majek restrs were not given by ZLA, but the ziggy 3 plate does say cross at 250 KTS. Does this restr still apply? I also do not remember being cleared specifically for this air carrier by ZLA, but we were filed for it. When we got on socal approach, the controller asked for our speed and I replied 280 KTS and slowing. He demanded to know who told us we could go this fast. I told him we were cleared to hitop and no speed given. He obviously was upset, and kept asking for an explanation. He asked if we could see a cargo aircraft, we said yes, and he stated they were on an 8 mi final doing 150 KTS. They were good boys and we were bad boys? We were the only 2 aircraft in the area at the time, and there was no traffic conflict. By this time, we had slowed, and were cleared for a visual approach to runway 26R. In our minds, we were going to hitop which has no speed restr, and apparently he felt we wre on the arrival and should have been at 250 KTS. Factors: first officer (4 yr) that likes to go fast to 'make up time.' I told him several times to slow down and go by the book. I did not notice that the restr said cross at 50 KTS. I was off getting a gate. In my mind, I had assumed the majek restr was not a factor because it had not been restated after the hitop clearance. Most say 'expect,' and a few say cross at XXX speed as a hard number. I knew that 280 KTS was too fast for hitop, but due to the fact that I had been on him about the speed and standardization, I let him go not thinking about the majek restr. Sometimes you are cleared for an arrival and other times not. I have asked in the past, and have been told that 'you were filed that way. We do not have to restate it.' I should have asked ZLA about the arrival, majek restrs, and if in fact we were cleared to hitop. We do not require that an arrival be briefed. Should we have to brief mandatory fixes and speeds? I certainly would not ignore a crossing restr. 'Keep the speed up' is a common ATC statement, and I guess we all get used to going as fast as we can to accommodate them and traffic flow. I also recommend that a crew not be alarmed by ATC over such an event. They still have to land and get to the gate. Our minds were on the crossing restr, and trying to remember exactly what happened. I did obtain a socal number and called the next morning to explain our side of the story.

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Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: PIC, PNF, DOES NOT CHALLENGE AND MONITOR FO'S 'FLY FAST' MIND SET AND FLC TURN DIRECT AN INTXN FURTHER CLRED TO ON THE STAR ENRTE TO ONT.

Narrative: ZLA HAD CLRED US TO CROSS 10 MI NW OF PMD AT FL240, THEN MAINTAIN FL230. DUE TO TFC, THIS WAS CHANGED TO MAINTAIN FL270. WHEN E OF PMD, AND CLR OF TFC, ZLA CLRED US TO CROSS HITOP AT 13000 FT. WE PUT HITOP AS THE NEXT FIX IN THE FMC AND BEGAN DSCNT AT 280 KTS. WE TOOK THIS TO MEAN ALSO THAT WE WERE CLRED DIRECT TO HITOP. THIS DELETED MAJEK EXPECT TO CROSS AT 14000 FT, AND CROSS AT 250 KTS RESTR IN THE FMC. THE MAJEK RESTRS WERE NOT GIVEN BY ZLA, BUT THE ZIGGY 3 PLATE DOES SAY CROSS AT 250 KTS. DOES THIS RESTR STILL APPLY? I ALSO DO NOT REMEMBER BEING CLRED SPECIFICALLY FOR THIS ACR BY ZLA, BUT WE WERE FILED FOR IT. WHEN WE GOT ON SOCAL APCH, THE CTLR ASKED FOR OUR SPD AND I REPLIED 280 KTS AND SLOWING. HE DEMANDED TO KNOW WHO TOLD US WE COULD GO THIS FAST. I TOLD HIM WE WERE CLRED TO HITOP AND NO SPD GIVEN. HE OBVIOUSLY WAS UPSET, AND KEPT ASKING FOR AN EXPLANATION. HE ASKED IF WE COULD SEE A CARGO ACFT, WE SAID YES, AND HE STATED THEY WERE ON AN 8 MI FINAL DOING 150 KTS. THEY WERE GOOD BOYS AND WE WERE BAD BOYS? WE WERE THE ONLY 2 ACFT IN THE AREA AT THE TIME, AND THERE WAS NO TFC CONFLICT. BY THIS TIME, WE HAD SLOWED, AND WERE CLRED FOR A VISUAL APCH TO RWY 26R. IN OUR MINDS, WE WERE GOING TO HITOP WHICH HAS NO SPD RESTR, AND APPARENTLY HE FELT WE WRE ON THE ARR AND SHOULD HAVE BEEN AT 250 KTS. FACTORS: FO (4 YR) THAT LIKES TO GO FAST TO 'MAKE UP TIME.' I TOLD HIM SEVERAL TIMES TO SLOW DOWN AND GO BY THE BOOK. I DID NOT NOTICE THAT THE RESTR SAID CROSS AT 50 KTS. I WAS OFF GETTING A GATE. IN MY MIND, I HAD ASSUMED THE MAJEK RESTR WAS NOT A FACTOR BECAUSE IT HAD NOT BEEN RESTATED AFTER THE HITOP CLRNC. MOST SAY 'EXPECT,' AND A FEW SAY CROSS AT XXX SPD AS A HARD NUMBER. I KNEW THAT 280 KTS WAS TOO FAST FOR HITOP, BUT DUE TO THE FACT THAT I HAD BEEN ON HIM ABOUT THE SPD AND STANDARDIZATION, I LET HIM GO NOT THINKING ABOUT THE MAJEK RESTR. SOMETIMES YOU ARE CLRED FOR AN ARR AND OTHER TIMES NOT. I HAVE ASKED IN THE PAST, AND HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT 'YOU WERE FILED THAT WAY. WE DO NOT HAVE TO RESTATE IT.' I SHOULD HAVE ASKED ZLA ABOUT THE ARR, MAJEK RESTRS, AND IF IN FACT WE WERE CLRED TO HITOP. WE DO NOT REQUIRE THAT AN ARR BE BRIEFED. SHOULD WE HAVE TO BRIEF MANDATORY FIXES AND SPDS? I CERTAINLY WOULD NOT IGNORE A XING RESTR. 'KEEP THE SPD UP' IS A COMMON ATC STATEMENT, AND I GUESS WE ALL GET USED TO GOING AS FAST AS WE CAN TO ACCOMMODATE THEM AND TFC FLOW. I ALSO RECOMMEND THAT A CREW NOT BE ALARMED BY ATC OVER SUCH AN EVENT. THEY STILL HAVE TO LAND AND GET TO THE GATE. OUR MINDS WERE ON THE XING RESTR, AND TRYING TO REMEMBER EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED. I DID OBTAIN A SOCAL NUMBER AND CALLED THE NEXT MORNING TO EXPLAIN OUR SIDE OF THE STORY.

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.