|37000 Feet||Browse and search NASA's
Aviation Safety Reporting System
|Local Time Of Day||1201 To 1800|
|Locale Reference||airport : dus|
|Altitude||msl bound lower : 5000|
msl bound upper : 6000
|Operator||general aviation : corporate|
|Navigation In Use||Other|
|Flight Phase||climbout : intermediate altitude|
|Route In Use||departure other|
departure sid : sid
|Function||flight crew : captain|
oversight : pic
|Experience||flight time total : 12000|
|Function||flight crew : first officer|
|Experience||flight time last 90 days : 100|
flight time total : 11000
flight time type : 3500
|Anomaly||altitude deviation : overshoot|
non adherence : published procedure
non adherence other
|Independent Detector||other controllera|
|Resolutory Action||none taken : detected after the fact|
|Air Traffic Incident||Pilot Deviation|
We were departing eddl, for a flight to leto. We received our clearance, and were proceeding to the departure runway. The copilot was going to fly this leg from the right seat. I asked that he review the departure, specifically the initial altitude. We had been given the norvenich five tango departure. My copilot said that he did not see an altitude restr, but would verify with tower. Approaching the hold line for departure runway, tower said that they had a whole new clearance for us. We pulled to the side of the holding area, to sort out new clearance. After 10 mins of searching for the new routing, I told my copilot to tell the tower that the new clearance did not make sense. He contacted the tower, and they replied that they concurred with our observation, and began to apologize and tell us how sorry they were to delay us. They said, will call you right back. Within a min, they came back and said that because of their mistake, we would get wonderful service and good radar vectors, and did not have to worry about the clearance. They then said that we were cleared for takeoff when ready, and departure would take care of us. We departed, and I switched to radar -- no answer -- went back to tower, and were told that departure frequency had changed, was now 128.85 instead of 128.55. Switched to correct frequency, made contact, and radar said we were cleared to FL120. I acknowledged and radar then asked what our altitude was. I replied passing FL60. They informed us that SID restr was 5000 ft. They were correct. I confessed, and said I was sorry, and their reply was 'you should be.' they then cleared us to FL230 and switched us to another frequency. Before switching, I again told them I was sorry for the altitude error, and they replied 'that's ok, no problem.' observations: 1) I should have checked SID more thoroughly myself and would probably have caught the 5000 ft altitude restr. 2) last min clearance change that was not correct, played a big factor. 3) were we still committed to SID? 4) telling us to takeoff, and contact departure, and they would take care of us did not help. 5) new departure frequency took time. Would probably not have been at 5000 ft before contact. 6) will make sure that I thoroughly brief SID, and will not rely on other pilot. 7) if in doubt, ask tower to verify altitude and did they want us to still fly the SID.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: FLC OF GULFSTREAM 4 OVERSHOT INITIAL ALT RESTR ON DEP FROM DUS.
Narrative: WE WERE DEPARTING EDDL, FOR A FLT TO LETO. WE RECEIVED OUR CLRNC, AND WERE PROCEEDING TO THE DEP RWY. THE COPLT WAS GOING TO FLY THIS LEG FROM THE R SEAT. I ASKED THAT HE REVIEW THE DEP, SPECIFICALLY THE INITIAL ALT. WE HAD BEEN GIVEN THE NORVENICH FIVE TANGO DEP. MY COPLT SAID THAT HE DID NOT SEE AN ALT RESTR, BUT WOULD VERIFY WITH TWR. APCHING THE HOLD LINE FOR DEP RWY, TWR SAID THAT THEY HAD A WHOLE NEW CLRNC FOR US. WE PULLED TO THE SIDE OF THE HOLDING AREA, TO SORT OUT NEW CLRNC. AFTER 10 MINS OF SEARCHING FOR THE NEW ROUTING, I TOLD MY COPLT TO TELL THE TWR THAT THE NEW CLRNC DID NOT MAKE SENSE. HE CONTACTED THE TWR, AND THEY REPLIED THAT THEY CONCURRED WITH OUR OBSERVATION, AND BEGAN TO APOLOGIZE AND TELL US HOW SORRY THEY WERE TO DELAY US. THEY SAID, WILL CALL YOU RIGHT BACK. WITHIN A MIN, THEY CAME BACK AND SAID THAT BECAUSE OF THEIR MISTAKE, WE WOULD GET WONDERFUL SVC AND GOOD RADAR VECTORS, AND DID NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE CLRNC. THEY THEN SAID THAT WE WERE CLRED FOR TKOF WHEN READY, AND DEP WOULD TAKE CARE OF US. WE DEPARTED, AND I SWITCHED TO RADAR -- NO ANSWER -- WENT BACK TO TWR, AND WERE TOLD THAT DEP FREQ HAD CHANGED, WAS NOW 128.85 INSTEAD OF 128.55. SWITCHED TO CORRECT FREQ, MADE CONTACT, AND RADAR SAID WE WERE CLRED TO FL120. I ACKNOWLEDGED AND RADAR THEN ASKED WHAT OUR ALT WAS. I REPLIED PASSING FL60. THEY INFORMED US THAT SID RESTR WAS 5000 FT. THEY WERE CORRECT. I CONFESSED, AND SAID I WAS SORRY, AND THEIR REPLY WAS 'YOU SHOULD BE.' THEY THEN CLRED US TO FL230 AND SWITCHED US TO ANOTHER FREQ. BEFORE SWITCHING, I AGAIN TOLD THEM I WAS SORRY FOR THE ALT ERROR, AND THEY REPLIED 'THAT'S OK, NO PROB.' OBSERVATIONS: 1) I SHOULD HAVE CHKED SID MORE THOROUGHLY MYSELF AND WOULD PROBABLY HAVE CAUGHT THE 5000 FT ALT RESTR. 2) LAST MIN CLRNC CHANGE THAT WAS NOT CORRECT, PLAYED A BIG FACTOR. 3) WERE WE STILL COMMITTED TO SID? 4) TELLING US TO TKOF, AND CONTACT DEP, AND THEY WOULD TAKE CARE OF US DID NOT HELP. 5) NEW DEP FREQ TOOK TIME. WOULD PROBABLY NOT HAVE BEEN AT 5000 FT BEFORE CONTACT. 6) WILL MAKE SURE THAT I THOROUGHLY BRIEF SID, AND WILL NOT RELY ON OTHER PLT. 7) IF IN DOUBT, ASK TWR TO VERIFY ALT AND DID THEY WANT US TO STILL FLY THE SID.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.