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37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
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Air carrier flight crew member tells of ZAU practices of radar vectoring for localizer intercept at ord with non associated DME distances being displayed. Could cause a clearance deviation.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 279740 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199408 |
| Day | Tue |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : ord |
| State Reference | IL |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zau |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | Commercial Fixed Wing |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Flight Phase | cruise other descent other |
| Route In Use | enroute : on vectors |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| ASRS Report | 279740 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | altitude deviation : crossing restriction not met non adherence : clearance other anomaly other other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | flight crew : became reoriented |
| Consequence | Other |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
| Air Traffic Incident | other |
| Situations | |
| ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
I submit this report in hopes that no one gets caught with their pants down until the problem is idented if not corrected. The distances I will mention are approximately. I first noticed this problem about a yr ago when I was given a crossing restr coming into ord and came very close to an altitude bust. At about 120 mi to the southwest of ord, center will sometimes give an intercept to the 4R localizer, frequency 110.1. When that frequency is put in you will get a DME of about 120 mi and it will be decreasing. I should mention that there is no DME associated with the runway 4R frequency of 110.1. If ord then gives you a crossing restr to be level at, say, 16000 ft 50 mi southwest of ord, and you have either not dialed in the ord VOR frequency or did not notice that there is no DME associated with H110.1, you could get yourself in trouble quickly. At about 100-75 DME on 110.1 it does start increasing again, so you'll notice something is wrong.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR FLC MEMBER TELLS OF ZAU PRACTICES OF RADAR VECTORING FOR LOC INTERCEPT AT ORD WITH NON ASSOCIATED DME DISTANCES BEING DISPLAYED. COULD CAUSE A CLRNC DEV.
Narrative: I SUBMIT THIS RPT IN HOPES THAT NO ONE GETS CAUGHT WITH THEIR PANTS DOWN UNTIL THE PROB IS IDENTED IF NOT CORRECTED. THE DISTANCES I WILL MENTION ARE APPROX. I FIRST NOTICED THIS PROB ABOUT A YR AGO WHEN I WAS GIVEN A XING RESTR COMING INTO ORD AND CAME VERY CLOSE TO AN ALT BUST. AT ABOUT 120 MI TO THE SW OF ORD, CTR WILL SOMETIMES GIVE AN INTERCEPT TO THE 4R LOC, FREQ 110.1. WHEN THAT FREQ IS PUT IN YOU WILL GET A DME OF ABOUT 120 MI AND IT WILL BE DECREASING. I SHOULD MENTION THAT THERE IS NO DME ASSOCIATED WITH THE RWY 4R FREQ OF 110.1. IF ORD THEN GIVES YOU A XING RESTR TO BE LEVEL AT, SAY, 16000 FT 50 MI SW OF ORD, AND YOU HAVE EITHER NOT DIALED IN THE ORD VOR FREQ OR DID NOT NOTICE THAT THERE IS NO DME ASSOCIATED WITH H110.1, YOU COULD GET YOURSELF IN TROUBLE QUICKLY. AT ABOUT 100-75 DME ON 110.1 IT DOES START INCREASING AGAIN, SO YOU'LL NOTICE SOMETHING IS WRONG.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.