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37000 Feet | Browse and search NASA's Aviation Safety Reporting System |
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Air carrier flight crew experiences loss of communication frequency with controling center. Frequency change wrong.
| Attributes | |
| ACN | 271930 |
| Time | |
| Date | 199405 |
| Day | Wed |
| Local Time Of Day | 1201 To 1800 |
| Place | |
| Locale Reference | atc facility : orf |
| State Reference | VA |
| Altitude | msl bound lower : 29000 msl bound upper : 29000 |
| Environment | |
| Flight Conditions | VMC |
| Light | Daylight |
| Aircraft 1 | |
| Controlling Facilities | artcc : zdc |
| Operator | common carrier : air carrier |
| Make Model Name | B737-300 |
| Operating Under FAR Part | Part 121 |
| Navigation In Use | Other Other |
| Flight Phase | cruise other other |
| Flight Plan | IFR |
| Person 1 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : captain oversight : pic |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Experience | flight time last 90 days : 130 flight time total : 25000 flight time type : 4000 |
| ASRS Report | 271930 |
| Person 2 | |
| Affiliation | company : air carrier |
| Function | flight crew : first officer |
| Qualification | pilot : atp |
| Events | |
| Anomaly | aircraft equipment problem : less severe non adherence : clearance other anomaly other |
| Independent Detector | other flight crewa |
| Resolutory Action | flight crew : overcame equipment problem |
| Consequence | Other |
| Supplementary | |
| Primary Problem | Ambiguous |
| Air Traffic Incident | Operational Deviation Pilot Deviation |
| Situations | |
| ATC Facility | procedure or policy : unspecified |
Narrative:
The question I would like to bring up is lost communication. Particularly in the high altitude structure with rapid speeds and high rates of descent. While descending into certain metropolitan areas. All roads in aviation seem to funnel into some very small focal points in certain parts of the country. The ny area. The controller and pilot is forced to feed a continuous stream of aircraft into almost key holes in the sky. To align aircraft into the appropriate approach tunnel for each major airport. Implicit in this maneuvering and descending is a series of radio frequency changes. Guess what? Someone is going to drop a frequency, the question is how long is too long to be without communication. 1, 2, or 3 minutes until you can retrieve an active frequency. Each one of those minutes can be 10 mi. Last week I had a situation develop that I did not like at all. Received a frequency change while starting the initial part of the descent. Highly congested and unable to make initial contact. Waited patiently for the volume to die down only to discover that we had the wrong frequency. Just 4 minutes (40 mi) plus another 2 minutes to get the appropriate sector. Any data on how frequently this happens? I feel there is a real hidden problem area. This note refers to flight from jax to phl. General location norfolk to 30 minutes north of VOR.
Original NASA ASRS Text
Title: ACR FLC EXPERIENCES LOSS OF COM FREQ WITH CTLING CTR. FREQ CHANGE WRONG.
Narrative: THE QUESTION I WOULD LIKE TO BRING UP IS LOST COM. PARTICULARLY IN THE HIGH ALT STRUCTURE WITH RAPID SPDS AND HIGH RATES OF DSCNT. WHILE DSNDING INTO CERTAIN METROPOLITAN AREAS. ALL ROADS IN AVIATION SEEM TO FUNNEL INTO SOME VERY SMALL FOCAL POINTS IN CERTAIN PARTS OF THE COUNTRY. THE NY AREA. THE CTLR AND PLT IS FORCED TO FEED A CONTINUOUS STREAM OF ACFT INTO ALMOST KEY HOLES IN THE SKY. TO ALIGN ACFT INTO THE APPROPRIATE APCH TUNNEL FOR EACH MAJOR ARPT. IMPLICIT IN THIS MANEUVERING AND DSNDING IS A SERIES OF RADIO FREQ CHANGES. GUESS WHAT? SOMEONE IS GOING TO DROP A FREQ, THE QUESTION IS HOW LONG IS TOO LONG TO BE WITHOUT COM. 1, 2, OR 3 MINUTES UNTIL YOU CAN RETRIEVE AN ACTIVE FREQ. EACH ONE OF THOSE MINUTES CAN BE 10 MI. LAST WK I HAD A SIT DEVELOP THAT I DID NOT LIKE AT ALL. RECEIVED A FREQ CHANGE WHILE STARTING THE INITIAL PART OF THE DSCNT. HIGHLY CONGESTED AND UNABLE TO MAKE INITIAL CONTACT. WAITED PATIENTLY FOR THE VOLUME TO DIE DOWN ONLY TO DISCOVER THAT WE HAD THE WRONG FREQ. JUST 4 MINUTES (40 MI) PLUS ANOTHER 2 MINUTES TO GET THE APPROPRIATE SECTOR. ANY DATA ON HOW FREQUENTLY THIS HAPPENS? I FEEL THERE IS A REAL HIDDEN PROB AREA. THIS NOTE REFERS TO FLT FROM JAX TO PHL. GENERAL LOCATION NORFOLK TO 30 MINUTES N OF VOR.
Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of July 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.