Small aircraft penetration of 30 mile ring of TCA. Transponder mode C requirement not available.

Attributes
ACN	123542
Time
Date	198909
Day	Wed
Local Time Of Day	1201 To 1800
Place
Locale Reference	atc facility : isp
State Reference	NY
Altitude	msl bound lower : 1400 msl bound upper : 1400
Environment
Flight Conditions	VMC
Light	Daylight
Aircraft 1
Controlling Facilities	tracon : n90 tower : flg
Operator	general aviation : instructional
Make Model Name	Small Aircraft, High Wing, 1 Eng, Fixed Gear
Flight Phase	cruise other cruise other cruise other
Route In Use	enroute : on vectors
Flight Plan	None
Person 1
Affiliation	Other
Function	flight crew : single pilot instruction : instructor
Qualification	pilot : cfi
Experience	flight time last 90 days : 200 flight time total : 2000 flight time type : 1000
ASRS Report	123542
Person 2
Affiliation	Other
Function	instruction : trainee
Qualification	pilot : student
Events
Anomaly	non adherence : far other anomaly other
Independent Detector	other flight crewa
Resolutory Action	controller : issued new clearance flight crew : exited penetrated airspace
Consequence	Other
Supplementary
Primary Problem	Ambiguous
Air Traffic Incident	other

Narrative:

On or about 9/wed/89, the installed ship's radio failed (bad antenna). Operating on backup hand-held, I found that we had to navigation very close to 5 NM ring of arsa to make radio contact. Ny approach informed us we were slightly inside the sfc to 4100' ring. While being radar vectored, a 270 degree heading took us inside the 30 NM mode C ring of jfk's TCA. We informed approach we were negative mode C, but they did not issue a turn for several mi. Far's require us to refuse ATC instructions that would violate a rule, but the attitude of the ATC is that it's ok to enter the 30-mi ring if you're being radar vectored. Radar vectors causing penetration of the mode C ring are commonplace on the west side of isp. Does ATC control this activity? Do they have the right to allow us to enter west/O mode C?

Original NASA ASRS Text

Title: SMA PENETRATION OF 30 MILE RING OF TCA. TRANSPONDER MODE C REQUIREMENT NOT AVAILABLE.

Narrative: ON OR ABOUT 9/WED/89, THE INSTALLED SHIP'S RADIO FAILED (BAD ANTENNA). OPERATING ON BACKUP HAND-HELD, I FOUND THAT WE HAD TO NAV VERY CLOSE TO 5 NM RING OF ARSA TO MAKE RADIO CONTACT. NY APCH INFORMED US WE WERE SLIGHTLY INSIDE THE SFC TO 4100' RING. WHILE BEING RADAR VECTORED, A 270 DEG HDG TOOK US INSIDE THE 30 NM MODE C RING OF JFK'S TCA. WE INFORMED APCH WE WERE NEGATIVE MODE C, BUT THEY DID NOT ISSUE A TURN FOR SEVERAL MI. FAR'S REQUIRE US TO REFUSE ATC INSTRUCTIONS THAT WOULD VIOLATE A RULE, BUT THE ATTITUDE OF THE ATC IS THAT IT'S OK TO ENTER THE 30-MI RING IF YOU'RE BEING RADAR VECTORED. RADAR VECTORS CAUSING PENETRATION OF THE MODE C RING ARE COMMONPLACE ON THE W SIDE OF ISP. DOES ATC CTL THIS ACTIVITY? DO THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO ALLOW US TO ENTER W/O MODE C?

Data retrieved from NASA's ASRS site as of August 2007 and automatically converted to unabbreviated mixed upper/lowercase text. This report is for informational purposes with no guarantee of accuracy. See NASA's ASRS site for official report.